Taverna WSDL Integration

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Taverna WSDL Integration

David B Ciar
Hello,

I'm looking into using Taverna, and I have been using the 52North WPS server for making R functions available.  I was searching on this forum and others to see if anyone else has used these together and I think from what I've read that it is not possible.

In the Taverna documentation, it details the need to use WSDL binding (http://www.taverna.org.uk/developers/web-service-developers/), however in a post to this forum last year it was mentioned that the WPS does not support WSDL files/binding (http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/How-to-get-WSDL-file-td4026054.html).

Am I following this correctly?  I also noticed the post discussing the WPS 2.0 specification software potentially being released this year, and I wondered if that is something that would be interoperable with Taverna.  

I'm asking as the WPS4R software is really fantastic, and it would be great to open it up to our users through workflow integration.

Best,
David
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Re: Taverna WSDL Integration

BenjaminPross
Hello David,

The WSDL (and SOAP) bindings seems to be useful for quite some people.
Too bad we had to remove them. It is also not in the WPS 2.0 core, but
there might be an extension at some point...
I have no advice right now but to hang in there... If you have ideas
regarding WPS, WSDL or workflows in general, we'd love to discuss them
with you.

Cheers,

Benjamin

Am 06.03.2016 um 05:59 schrieb David B Ciar:

> Hello,
>
> I'm looking into using Taverna, and I have been using the 52North WPS server
> for making R functions available.  I was searching on this forum and others
> to see if anyone else has used these together and I think from what I've
> read that it is not possible.
>
> In the Taverna documentation, it details the need to use WSDL binding
> (http://www.taverna.org.uk/developers/web-service-developers/), however in a
> post to this forum last year it was mentioned that the WPS does not support
> WSDL files/binding
> (http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/How-to-get-WSDL-file-td4026054.html).
>
> Am I following this correctly?  I also noticed the post discussing the WPS
> 2.0 specification software potentially being released this year, and I
> wondered if that is something that would be interoperable with Taverna.
>
> I'm asking as the WPS4R software is really fantastic, and it would be great
> to open it up to our users through workflow integration.
>
> Best,
> David
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/Taverna-WSDL-Integration-tp4026164.html
> Sent from the 52° North - Geoprocessing Community Forum mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> _______________________________________________
> Geoprocessingservices mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://list.52north.org/mailman/listinfo/geoprocessingservices
> http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org
> Please respect our mailing list guidelines:
> http://52north.org/resources/mailing-lists-and-forums/guidelines


--
Benjamin Proß
Software Engineer
52°North Geoprocessing Community

52°North Initiative for Geospatial Open Source Software GmbH
Martin-Luther-King-Weg 24
Fon: +49-(0)-251–396371-42
Fax: +49-(0)-251–396371-11
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Local Court Muenster HRB 10849

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Re: Taverna WSDL Integration

Christoph Stasch
Hi David,

one small addition: 

In the OGC Testbed 12 that recently started [1], options for providing a SOAP Binding and a prototypical implementation of a WPS offering a SOAP binding will be developed. However, these will probably not be available before the end of the Testbed in autumn 2016.

Best regards,

Christoph

2016-03-08 19:06 GMT+01:00 Benjamin Proß <[hidden email]>:
Hello David,

The WSDL (and SOAP) bindings seems to be useful for quite some people. Too bad we had to remove them. It is also not in the WPS 2.0 core, but there might be an extension at some point...
I have no advice right now but to hang in there... If you have ideas regarding WPS, WSDL or workflows in general, we'd love to discuss them with you.

Cheers,

Benjamin

Am 06.03.2016 um 05:59 schrieb David B Ciar:
Hello,

I'm looking into using Taverna, and I have been using the 52North WPS server
for making R functions available.  I was searching on this forum and others
to see if anyone else has used these together and I think from what I've
read that it is not possible.

In the Taverna documentation, it details the need to use WSDL binding
(http://www.taverna.org.uk/developers/web-service-developers/), however in a
post to this forum last year it was mentioned that the WPS does not support
WSDL files/binding
(http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/How-to-get-WSDL-file-td4026054.html).

Am I following this correctly?  I also noticed the post discussing the WPS
2.0 specification software potentially being released this year, and I
wondered if that is something that would be interoperable with Taverna.

I'm asking as the WPS4R software is really fantastic, and it would be great
to open it up to our users through workflow integration.

Best,
David



--
View this message in context: http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/Taverna-WSDL-Integration-tp4026164.html
Sent from the 52° North - Geoprocessing Community Forum mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
_______________________________________________
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--
Benjamin Proß
Software Engineer
52°North Geoprocessing Community

52°North Initiative for Geospatial Open Source Software GmbH
Martin-Luther-King-Weg 24
Fon: <a href="tel:%2B49-%280%29-251%E2%80%93396371-42" value="+4925139637142" target="_blank">+49-(0)-251–396371-42
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B49-%280%29-251%E2%80%93396371-11" value="+4925139637111" target="_blank">+49-(0)-251–396371-11
[hidden email]
http://52north.org/

General Managers: Dr. Albert Remke, Dr. Andreas Wytzisk
Local Court Muenster HRB 10849

_______________________________________________
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http://list.52north.org/mailman/listinfo/geoprocessingservices
http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org
Please respect our mailing list guidelines:
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Re: Taverna WSDL Integration

Matthias Müller

Hi David,

 

the WPS-WSDL bindings in 1.0 are a bit odd compared to the common WSDL services you might know. They are actually wrappers for the WPS operations GetCapabilities, DescribeProcess and Execute (see http://schemas.opengis.net/wps/1.0.0/examples/example_service.wsdl). They do not provide true WSDL interface descriptions for operations like Buffer, Intersect or ConvexHull.

 

That said, a vanilla workflow engine for WSDL cannot create valid requests/responses form the WPS-WSDL descriptions. It just doesn’t know how to  link the constraints from DescribeProcess to Execute. Things are even more complicated with multiple Execute and DescribeProcess operations like in the linked example (e.g. ExecuteProcess_GMLAreaGeometries, ExecuteProcess_GMLBufferRequest, ExecuteProcess_GMLConvexHull, DescribeProcess_GMLAreaGeometries, DescribeProcess_GMLBuffer, DescribeProcess_GMLConvexHull, …). There’s no machine-readable way to let the WSDL client know which DescribeProcess and Execute operations go together. That is again a manual task (look at the operation names and make a good guess) for which you won’t get any support from the WSDL frameworks out there. So WSDL with WPS isn’t exactly interoperable.

 

Cheers,

Matthias

 

--

Matthias Müller

Dipl.-Geogr. | Research Associate

 

Technische Universität Dresden

Chair of Geoinformatics

01062 Dresden

 

Phone: +49 351 463-31953

Fax: +49 351 463-35879

Mail: [hidden email]

 

www: http://tu-dresden.de/uw/geo/geoinfo

 

From: Geoprocessingservices [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Christoph Stasch
Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2016 6:27 AM
To: Benjamin Proß
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [52N Geoprocessingservices] Taverna WSDL Integration

 

Hi David,

 

one small addition: 

 

In the OGC Testbed 12 that recently started [1], options for providing a SOAP Binding and a prototypical implementation of a WPS offering a SOAP binding will be developed. However, these will probably not be available before the end of the Testbed in autumn 2016.

 

Best regards,

 

Christoph

 

2016-03-08 19:06 GMT+01:00 Benjamin Proß <[hidden email]>:

Hello David,

The WSDL (and SOAP) bindings seems to be useful for quite some people. Too bad we had to remove them. It is also not in the WPS 2.0 core, but there might be an extension at some point...
I have no advice right now but to hang in there... If you have ideas regarding WPS, WSDL or workflows in general, we'd love to discuss them with you.

Cheers,

Benjamin

Am 06.03.2016 um 05:59 schrieb David B Ciar:

Hello,

I'm looking into using Taverna, and I have been using the 52North WPS server
for making R functions available.  I was searching on this forum and others
to see if anyone else has used these together and I think from what I've
read that it is not possible.

In the Taverna documentation, it details the need to use WSDL binding
(http://www.taverna.org.uk/developers/web-service-developers/), however in a
post to this forum last year it was mentioned that the WPS does not support
WSDL files/binding
(http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/How-to-get-WSDL-file-td4026054.html).

Am I following this correctly?  I also noticed the post discussing the WPS
2.0 specification software potentially being released this year, and I
wondered if that is something that would be interoperable with Taverna.

I'm asking as the WPS4R software is really fantastic, and it would be great
to open it up to our users through workflow integration.

Best,
David



--
View this message in context: http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org/Taverna-WSDL-Integration-tp4026164.html
Sent from the 52° North - Geoprocessing Community Forum mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
_______________________________________________
Geoprocessingservices mailing list
[hidden email]
http://list.52north.org/mailman/listinfo/geoprocessingservices
http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org
Please respect our mailing list guidelines:
http://52north.org/resources/mailing-lists-and-forums/guidelines



--
Benjamin Proß
Software Engineer
52°North Geoprocessing Community

52°North Initiative for Geospatial Open Source Software GmbH
Martin-Luther-King-Weg 24
Fon: <a href="tel:%2B49-%280%29-251%E2%80%93396371-42" target="_blank">+49-(0)-251–396371-42
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B49-%280%29-251%E2%80%93396371-11" target="_blank">+49-(0)-251–396371-11
[hidden email]
http://52north.org/

General Managers: Dr. Albert Remke, Dr. Andreas Wytzisk
Local Court Muenster HRB 10849

_______________________________________________
Geoprocessingservices mailing list
[hidden email]
http://list.52north.org/mailman/listinfo/geoprocessingservices
http://geoprocessing.forum.52north.org
Please respect our mailing list guidelines:
http://52north.org/resources/mailing-lists-and-forums/guidelines

 


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Re: Taverna WSDL Integration

David B Ciar
In reply to this post by Christoph Stasch
Hello Benjamin, Christoph, Mathias,

First, thank you for the quick replies, and apologies for my late - I haven't been able to revisit the WPS work until now.

@ Benjamin, The workflow I was thinking of was prompted by two things:

- The paper 'WPS orchestration using the Taverna workbench: The eScience approach (Jesus et all, 2011)', which describes a way of accessing their Python based WPS server through Taverna in a fairly straightforward way (though I haven't tried to use or replicate).
- A number of web services listed in Taverna (Workbench Enterprise 2.5.0) by default, including http://www.ebi.ac.uk/Tools/webservices/, which appear to be straightforward drag - drop - use in the workflow.

Both of the above made it seem like it could be possible to have a straightforward mapping between the Taverna component inputs/outputs and a WPS based process' inputs/outputs, hence the question.  The reason I wanted to try to do this is to potentially open up a specific WPS instance to a larger audience.

At the moment I'm using the 52N WPS 1.0 to host forecasting and QC processes, which I'm integrating with the SOS.  In this instance, scripting is OK, but some of the forecasting and R routines I'm using may be of interest for others to use but currently are not packaged, or require a good-spec server to process in a usable amount of time.  I thought if it were possible to represent the processes as drag-drop components in a workflow, it may lower the difficulty level somewhat for more people to use the hosted processes, rather than having them go through a library wrapping up the http requests in a friendlier way.

@ Mathias, your explanation is extremely clear and helpful in explaining the issue of WSDL clients working with WPS.  You were right in that my comparing other non-WPS WSDL services to WPS was not a good choice, now that I've looked into the other services a bit more.

Thanks guys for making it clear about the issues involved, it's really helped,

Best,
David
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